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	<title>Comments on: An Open Prayer for the SBC&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/</link>
	<description>[live... from planet earth]</description>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-155</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 14:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-155</guid>
		<description>Jerry,

Let me confirm what Joe has told you.  This post appeared independent of SBC Outpost.  I like Joe.  I like Joe&#039;s blog.  I would recommend you read more than just this one post to get an idea of where Joe&#039;s heart is.  If you would have done that before posting your comment you would have kept your comment to yourself.

I saw this post and I asked Joe if I could have his permission to re-print it on the Outpost.  If you have an issue it should be with my motivations for doing so, not with Joe.  If you want to discuss my motivations you can e-mail me at paul.littleton@sbcglobal.net.

Honestly, the reason I did not allow for comments at SBC Outpost is for comments just like yours. Prayers don&#039;t need your critique.  They don&#039;t need my critique.  If you want to be the prayer police take it up with me, not Joe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jerry,</p>
<p>Let me confirm what Joe has told you.  This post appeared independent of SBC Outpost.  I like Joe.  I like Joe&#8217;s blog.  I would recommend you read more than just this one post to get an idea of where Joe&#8217;s heart is.  If you would have done that before posting your comment you would have kept your comment to yourself.</p>
<p>I saw this post and I asked Joe if I could have his permission to re-print it on the Outpost.  If you have an issue it should be with my motivations for doing so, not with Joe.  If you want to discuss my motivations you can e-mail me at <a href="mailto:paul.littleton@sbcglobal.net">paul.littleton@sbcglobal.net</a>.</p>
<p>Honestly, the reason I did not allow for comments at SBC Outpost is for comments just like yours. Prayers don&#8217;t need your critique.  They don&#8217;t need my critique.  If you want to be the prayer police take it up with me, not Joe.</p>
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		<title>By: Mandolyn</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-154</link>
		<dc:creator>Mandolyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 02:17:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-154</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t really know where to post this comment, but I suppose here is as good as any.

First, I want to say that you are thorough and intelligent in your posts, which I commend.  What I am about to say is NOT an attack on you, or the SBC.  Please understand that upfront; it is more of a challenge to the church at whole.

I am a rather biblically knowledgeable twenty-something (my undergrad is in Christian Studies).  I come from a generation where if we don&#039;t see it, we don&#039;t believe it.  Honestly, in my experience (which I know is NOT the only thing we should base our decisions on, and I don&#039;t), I have not seen true love from any SBC church I have attended.  All I have seen is hypocrisy, heresy, and condemnation from those who, in lack of a better terminology, excommunicate people for sins which they themselves have committed.  It honestly came to the point where, because of what I have experienced and seen among the SBC (through churches I was a part of and a school I went to), I &#039;gave up&#039; my faith for nearly a year.  I refused to step in any church unless I was attending a wedding or funeral.   I said [edited version]&quot;screw Christianity.  If this is really what it is about, forget it; I will not put my name to this garbage.  Then, I realized that I had let my disillusionment and bitterness with the church at large become my god, instead of God being my god.  I started to attend church on Sundays again, but I was hurt so badly by 2 rather large SBC churches, I still cannot, nor do I have the desire to, step into an SBC church again.  I am just one of the many voices of my disenchanted generation who have seen so much more evil, rather than good, come from the SBC.  My prayer for the SBC is for the members of it to stop their hypocrisy and evil ways, and start a revolutionary movement of love.  I say this because if my generation does not get more involved in the Christian church as a whole, the Christian church will not exist in America in the future.  We are the future.  If the future sees no love in the church, they sure are not going to be a part of it.  It WILL die.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t really know where to post this comment, but I suppose here is as good as any.</p>
<p>First, I want to say that you are thorough and intelligent in your posts, which I commend.  What I am about to say is NOT an attack on you, or the SBC.  Please understand that upfront; it is more of a challenge to the church at whole.</p>
<p>I am a rather biblically knowledgeable twenty-something (my undergrad is in Christian Studies).  I come from a generation where if we don&#8217;t see it, we don&#8217;t believe it.  Honestly, in my experience (which I know is NOT the only thing we should base our decisions on, and I don&#8217;t), I have not seen true love from any SBC church I have attended.  All I have seen is hypocrisy, heresy, and condemnation from those who, in lack of a better terminology, excommunicate people for sins which they themselves have committed.  It honestly came to the point where, because of what I have experienced and seen among the SBC (through churches I was a part of and a school I went to), I &#8216;gave up&#8217; my faith for nearly a year.  I refused to step in any church unless I was attending a wedding or funeral.   I said [edited version]&#8220;screw Christianity.  If this is really what it is about, forget it; I will not put my name to this garbage.  Then, I realized that I had let my disillusionment and bitterness with the church at large become my god, instead of God being my god.  I started to attend church on Sundays again, but I was hurt so badly by 2 rather large SBC churches, I still cannot, nor do I have the desire to, step into an SBC church again.  I am just one of the many voices of my disenchanted generation who have seen so much more evil, rather than good, come from the SBC.  My prayer for the SBC is for the members of it to stop their hypocrisy and evil ways, and start a revolutionary movement of love.  I say this because if my generation does not get more involved in the Christian church as a whole, the Christian church will not exist in America in the future.  We are the future.  If the future sees no love in the church, they sure are not going to be a part of it.  It WILL die.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Kennedy</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-153</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Kennedy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Sep 2007 21:56:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-153</guid>
		<description>Jerry,

Paul asked me if he could post the prayer, and I gave him permission.  Had any other SBC bloggers asked to post it, I would have done the same.  Regardless of what you may think about the SBC Outpost (a blog I rarely read, by the way), you should know I consider several of the contributers to be friends, albeit via the blogosphere.  Many of us are actually trying to blog through the Spiritual Disciplines, which I imagine both you and I would consider beneficial and fruitful discussion.  You may do what you wish with my prayer.

I don&#039;t know if you&#039;ve ever been to my blog before, but who said I wasn&#039;t acting on my convictions?  What else would you have me do?  I&#039;m doing the best I can, knowing the best I&#039;ve got isn&#039;t enough.  How about you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jerry,</p>
<p>Paul asked me if he could post the prayer, and I gave him permission.  Had any other SBC bloggers asked to post it, I would have done the same.  Regardless of what you may think about the SBC Outpost (a blog I rarely read, by the way), you should know I consider several of the contributers to be friends, albeit via the blogosphere.  Many of us are actually trying to blog through the Spiritual Disciplines, which I imagine both you and I would consider beneficial and fruitful discussion.  You may do what you wish with my prayer.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know if you&#8217;ve ever been to my blog before, but who said I wasn&#8217;t acting on my convictions?  What else would you have me do?  I&#8217;m doing the best I can, knowing the best I&#8217;ve got isn&#8217;t enough.  How about you?</p>
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		<title>By: Jerry Grace</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-152</link>
		<dc:creator>Jerry Grace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Sep 2007 21:49:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-152</guid>
		<description>Please,

Is this a prayer or a sermon?   Are you asking God for something or are you giving him instructions?  Are these words meant for Him or crafted for the rest of us to read, designed to demonstrate your sincerity and eloquence?

&quot;I ask that you would bring your Spirit upon the true Christ-followers in the SBC; that we would walk in your Spirit; and we would be known as “Little Christs” once more.&quot;

I suppose this means that by the &quot;we&quot; you consider yourself to be one of the &quot;true Christ Followers&quot; as compared to the obviously millons who are surely not judged by the same objective standard.  And I suppose that by extension somehow you have lost the identity somewhere at sometime of being a &quot;Little Christ.&quot;

You might be offended by these words, others will jump to your defense, some might brand me as trying to pick a fight.  I have no reason to believe that every word you wrote, which by the way makes a fine sermon, are not as genuine as they appear.  I have no reason to believe that you are not a &quot;true follower of Christ&quot; or that you are the model &quot;little Christ.&quot;  In fact I find myself agreeing with virtually every lament you mention on behalf of the Convention and might even agree with you about many of the individuals in the convention who exhibit the selfish behavior I am certain offends you as it does me.

But when I find this prayer posted on SBCoutpost I cannot help but wonder as to who the hearers are intended to be.  Perhaps you had nothing to do with its appearance there; they would not allow comment; but thankfully you as the author do.

I would offer an observation to you: God does not need a lot of background information in our prayers.  He does not need history lessons or scriptural references or conjoined platitudes selected at random, in fact nothing at all other than the penitent heart of the one doing the praying.


You say, &quot;I pray that our church members would renew their hearts toward the pursuit of holiness, both on a personal and a collective level.&quot;

Sounds good but pray tell how hearts pursuing holiness can do so on a collective level without first in each and every individual in that pursuit do so on a personal level.  Holiness on a cumulative level is nothing more than the sum of what exists on a personal level.  Pray for personal holiness for yourself, teach a Sunday School Class, minister to others in need of ministering, make sure every area of your own personal life is in order, love your family, love others as you love yourself and love the Lord your God enough to believe he is approachable in the same language and with the same words you use elsewhere in your life.

And as for the Southern Baptist Convention, pray if you feel led to help you put together enough votes to throw the bums out.  But act on your convictions.  I might even join you.

Jerry Grace</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please,</p>
<p>Is this a prayer or a sermon?   Are you asking God for something or are you giving him instructions?  Are these words meant for Him or crafted for the rest of us to read, designed to demonstrate your sincerity and eloquence?</p>
<p>&#8220;I ask that you would bring your Spirit upon the true Christ-followers in the SBC; that we would walk in your Spirit; and we would be known as “Little Christs” once more.&#8221;</p>
<p>I suppose this means that by the &#8220;we&#8221; you consider yourself to be one of the &#8220;true Christ Followers&#8221; as compared to the obviously millons who are surely not judged by the same objective standard.  And I suppose that by extension somehow you have lost the identity somewhere at sometime of being a &#8220;Little Christ.&#8221;</p>
<p>You might be offended by these words, others will jump to your defense, some might brand me as trying to pick a fight.  I have no reason to believe that every word you wrote, which by the way makes a fine sermon, are not as genuine as they appear.  I have no reason to believe that you are not a &#8220;true follower of Christ&#8221; or that you are the model &#8220;little Christ.&#8221;  In fact I find myself agreeing with virtually every lament you mention on behalf of the Convention and might even agree with you about many of the individuals in the convention who exhibit the selfish behavior I am certain offends you as it does me.</p>
<p>But when I find this prayer posted on SBCoutpost I cannot help but wonder as to who the hearers are intended to be.  Perhaps you had nothing to do with its appearance there; they would not allow comment; but thankfully you as the author do.</p>
<p>I would offer an observation to you: God does not need a lot of background information in our prayers.  He does not need history lessons or scriptural references or conjoined platitudes selected at random, in fact nothing at all other than the penitent heart of the one doing the praying.</p>
<p>You say, &#8220;I pray that our church members would renew their hearts toward the pursuit of holiness, both on a personal and a collective level.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sounds good but pray tell how hearts pursuing holiness can do so on a collective level without first in each and every individual in that pursuit do so on a personal level.  Holiness on a cumulative level is nothing more than the sum of what exists on a personal level.  Pray for personal holiness for yourself, teach a Sunday School Class, minister to others in need of ministering, make sure every area of your own personal life is in order, love your family, love others as you love yourself and love the Lord your God enough to believe he is approachable in the same language and with the same words you use elsewhere in your life.</p>
<p>And as for the Southern Baptist Convention, pray if you feel led to help you put together enough votes to throw the bums out.  But act on your convictions.  I might even join you.</p>
<p>Jerry Grace</p>
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		<title>By: Bryan Riley</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-151</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan Riley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 02:05:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-151</guid>
		<description>Yes and amen.  I would add that I do not believe true revival will come until we realize that it can&#039;t be just for the SBC.  Until we realize that we are one in the Body of Christ beyond the SBC.  Unity can&#039;t just be within a denomination.  It must be within the entire Church.  Repentance for the revival to come includes repenting of our sins of creating disharmony and not doing all we can to live at peace with others.

Let it rain!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes and amen.  I would add that I do not believe true revival will come until we realize that it can&#8217;t be just for the SBC.  Until we realize that we are one in the Body of Christ beyond the SBC.  Unity can&#8217;t just be within a denomination.  It must be within the entire Church.  Repentance for the revival to come includes repenting of our sins of creating disharmony and not doing all we can to live at peace with others.</p>
<p>Let it rain!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Dorcas Hawker</title>
		<link>http://www.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/comment-page-1/#comment-150</link>
		<dc:creator>Dorcas Hawker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Sep 2007 18:16:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.wordsarenotenough.com/2007/09/04/an-open-prayer-for-the-sbc/#comment-150</guid>
		<description>amen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>amen.</p>
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